TTE Block:
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Was on another forum (and a thread about mapping came up) in particular a person by the name of Gerry Gaffney (does dastek mapping in scotland)
Gerry Gaffney":2rz999ho said:
As for the comments on the quality of the mapping, I mapped the car personally, & having mapped cars for the likes of Alistair McRae, Carlos Sainz, & Julian Bailey (I was an engine builder for Toyota Motorsport), as well as having taught over 50 rolling road tuning companies in the UK how to map cars, I'd like to think I have a proven track record here.
So naturally I had to ask a question about engine blocks
, mainly from this thread of TTE parts prices from Hic
here
block gp A (unbreakable!!): 1450E 3mm lower than std block
So anywhoo I asked:-
Gerry Gaffney":2rz999ho said:
Hi Hob,
I worked for Toyota GB (ST185 3S-GTE Grp A) & Toyota SA (Camry & Corolla 3S-GE ISTC)
The only difference is that the blocks were hand picked from the production line, & ultrasonically tested for core shift & uniform thickness. The only other bit that was 'special' was that the head bolts were 20mm longer (& the coresponding threads in the block deeper) allowing greating clamping force for the head gasket, other than that just normal competition engine building practices.
So to me looks as if it was just a thickwalled stock block (for the 185 ?) the price of ~£1000 seems in line with that of a new block from mr T ? (£700 + vat?)
But... the 205 block now (unsure if it's due to lack of stock/ production) is about £2700 and I'm still intrigued as to the difference between that and stock as the water ways etc must be the same as it fits a stock faff head afaik ?
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*UPDATE*
Finally found a picture of a TTE 185 Group A block
"The engine they had on the rally-cars are very much different from the stock 3s-gte, they tired to run stock blocks in the beginning but it last about 20min before they cracked.
I´m not sure about all the models but in the st185 engine TTE special made:
Block, used another metal, 3mm lower
Crank, forged steel
Oil-pan, titanium with different internals
Oil-pump, high volume
Water pump, high volume
Headgasket, steel
Cams, special-made
and so on....."
Deffo made from another material as everyone I have spoken to have said the same thing...
TTE:
TTE Vs Stock (Both 185):
Image shows that toyota cast the block (notice the logo present on both top right)
means to-yo-ta in japanese.
You can see the difference in height also notice what looks like generally cleaner casting?, I wonder if internally (#2 & #3 in particular, *edit* it doesn't look like it and still seems a weak spot!).
Toyota Cast all of the motorpport bloks (503e/tte etc) used in pikes peaks etc, TTE just machined the block to fit the gearbox etc, it was most likely produced in Toyotas Kamigo Plant.
The block can take a lot more abuse as the rally cars did run ~ 450 ft/lb of torque, it is suggested that the beams engine (lexus IS200) has a revised block (used in corolla wrc)....
Sooooo long shot in the dark, *maybe* toyota made the beams block stronger in the revised design so that the corolla could run with a stock block? There is a suggestion on another forum (3sgte block cracking) that the beams engine is stronger and much less likely to crack..
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The 503e Engine Block:
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Caldina Revised Engine:
(ok I *think* this is the caldina block, the one where mr T changed part numbers in 98/99, more on this below)
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*Intresting bit*
The caldina block apparantly fixes one other cracking problem:
"That's got to be a stress crack where the block is at its weakest when trying to hold the head down. On your next block, I strongly suggest getting one of the post '99 blocks that are solid through that area behind the water pump instead of having that small little "hump" to hold the stud in."
"I have the number for the block, as im using one of those right now and yes they are reinforced around that area
everything fitted except that 4 bolts holding the "splash guard" in the oil pan was M8 instead of M6, so you just have to drill larger holes in that plate, no big deal"
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Now the even more intresting bit:-
(Block is a gen 2 185 one!)
Cut my block apart today, just to see how it locked. the thinnest part i could find where between no2 and 3 cyl in the water channel 3,22mm
But in the crack the thinnest part was 3,97mm
Here is the backside of the crack in cyl 2
So looks like it has cracked in the thickest part of the block?
Also looks like maybe the blocks are also cast from inconel the same as the manifolds?
Similar colour 8)
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Lexus "Beams" 3sge:
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The final incarnation of the 3sge range, featuring a revised head with vvti this engine came in various states of tune "red/grey/black top" from mr2/celica and lexus models.
According to rally & high bhp cars on the net, this is the block to get, Lexus derived thi is apparently a much stronger block. Toyota changed to this block during the wrc testing phase after ditching the faff block and iirc it also had a quad throttle body system on the inlet manifold.
The casting marks on the outside have less relation to the 503e and the faff block looks more like the 503e externally, what I hope is that lexus/toyota revised the #2/#3 coolant passage to be more like the 5s or improved further, this can only be confirmed by ultrasound/cutting the block up. Unfortunately these blocks are very very rare!
503e/185/Beams
Beams/TTE outer casting
Beams/Caldina